How to remove front top shackle bushing?

[Old Henry]

Thanks to some good friends with sharp eyes on the barn I have discovered my upper shackle bushings on the front of my 47 are very worn and needing replaced.



I tried pounding them out years ago but they wouldn't budge. What else to try?

And, a related question is, where do I get that bushing? The usual suppliers don't seem to have it. I suppose if I can't find one but could get this one out in one piece I could just put it back in upside down and wear on the other surface for the next couple of hundred thousand miles?

Until then, I'm certainly going to pack that space with grease to reduce the wear until I can replace it.

[cmbrucew]

Prof.
Fire dragon ( cutting torch ) works good for shackle pin bushings or walking beams.
Bruce

[Mart]

First safely remove the spring. (make sure the jack don't slip).

Knock the pin through (you might have to cut it in half to clear the axle) or pull it out forwards if you can.

Get a hacksaw blade in there and cut through the wall of the tubular outer shell (or remnants thereof).

Get a chisel behind the shell and collapse it inwards.

It's a lot easier to write than do.

Actually putting the new ones in is sometimes harder, they want to belly out when being pressed in. There must be a proper tool for it, but I've normally managed with suitable size sockets. I did have to take a vice to the rear axle on my 33 as it was the only thing strong enough to press the new ones in.

Your problem may be dealing with the worn lower area of the hole. With the whole world watching it will be difficult to do a bodge-it-and-scarper type job.

There may be some street rod type bushings that could be used that would make the job simpler, but your car is a lot heavier than the A's and 32's they're usually used on.

On a different, but connected subject, the third leaf on the leaf spring looks to be quite sharp on the end and it looks like it has been digging into the second leaf.

By the way, changing perch bushes is one I hate with a vengeance.

Here's my struggle with the rear perches on my 33. I don't think even this would work on your front end.


Good Luck.

Mart.

[Henry Hopper]

I've just been through this with my 40.....I removed the pin by using a blowtorch and burning the rubber until it became loose and then knocked it through.Next as Mart said, cut through the sleeve with a junior hacksaw and then got a punch and tried drifting it out......no way was it going to budge, so I started heating the sleeve until it got cherry red and tried again....this caved the end in and a few small bits broke out.I had previously made a drift punch out of an old socket extension by turning the female end down to the diameter of the sleeve when I did the rear shackle bushes.....I heated the outer sleeve(perch) and proceeded to whack it with my sledge hammer.........eventually one came out....the other was a real PITA and only came out when I took the wishbone off and set it up in the vice where I could really give it some pain.

It really is a nasty job and there are no quick fixes unfortunately...the only job worse is trying to get perch bolts out of an axle/ wishbone assembly.

Good luck...and wear good gloves to save your knuckles.

[Andy]

I put replacment shackles in my 32. The rubber collapsed after 3 months and the spring was tuching the axle again. I have used hot rod shackles on my roadster since 1970. I use oilite broze bushings in them instead of the plastic. I took it all apart recently and found negligble wear. The original style shackles were from Mac's. The hot rod shackles are very easy to install.

[Old Henry]

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I got the pin/bolt out pretty easy since the hole it was in is so oversized now from the wear. And, it may be that the bushing is so thin, if non-existent on the bottom worn side, that it might give way and come out easier than I'm thinking. If not, it won't take much sawing on that thin section to cut through it allowing the bushing to collapse and let loose. We'll see.

My other thought is to drill it out with progressively larger bits. That would only work if the bushing is softer than the perch such that the bit would bite more off of the bushing than the perch.

Just thinking out loud here.

Of course, if I can't find a replacement bushing there won't be much to do but just grease that baby up regularly to retard any further wear -hopefully for the duration of my use of it.

[Mart]

I strongly advise trying to find some NOS parts, the modern repro parts are copies of copies of copies by progressively less skilled copiers.

Utter crap is another way of putting it.

Don't try drilling it out. It's 3/4" od and the drill will grab and twist your arm off.

Mart.

[Old Henry]

Is this the bushing? http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Replacem...a4eb57&vxp=mtr

It doesn't look like it but if it is I'll buy it.

[Lawrie]

Henry,I have a u shaped piece of 1in plate that is about10 inches between the U.
I use a selection of round pieces of bar that are just smaller than the OD of the bush and have a hole in the middle so the shackle pin can go in,the I use a small port power cylinder and push them out,
If you want pics let me know.
Lawrie

[Torchie]

My 2 cents.
I needed to replace all the shackle and studs on my 41. They are the metal sleeve type with the rubber around the stud/pin.
Used a torch to melt the rubber and pushed out the stud.
Then I used an 11/16 drill bit with a T handled drill and drilled out the metal sleeve. Just enough sleeve was left to use a small punch to curl back and remove the remainder.
I used 11/16 on the drill bit as that seems to be the size of the tool that is sold to install and remove these with. Yes you need to be careful as the drill will want to spin. Hence the T handled drill.
Best done with the axle removed from the car.
Good luck Henry

[bill h]

I think what you want is part number 21a 5304. All the major companies (van pelts lists them in his on lone catalog. So does Midwest EarlyFord. Take them to a spring shop. They will install them in about one minute. They have the right tools . I have wrecked more than one when trying to install them even with a press. They cheap order a extra Bill

[ford3]

use a brake hone and run it thru the bushing hole and taper the end of the bushing, polish the bushing, hook up the bushing to your drill press and use emery cloth to polish, use stp for lubricant it sure makes it easier to press in

[Lawrie]

Here is the stuff I use.
It is easy to use on the rear of the 33 in place,but I just did one on the right front in place and it was a bit awquard Also Henry, you want to do what I did and disassemble the spring,clean it polish off the grooves,layer it in grease then wrap it in Denso tape,you won't believe how nice it rides after that,also it will keep all that snow and stuff we don't have here out of the spring.LOL
Lawrie

[Brian]

Before you fit your nice new shackle pin assembly, you're going to have to get the hole round again. It is elongated where the pin has chewed into it. Need to build up the worn portion and ream back to size. As previously stated, the hole should be 3/4" dia.
Plus, as Mart has identified, the spring leaves are badly grooved, this whole assembly should be removed and overhauled.

[Mart]

To answer the question about the bush, no that isn't the right one.

Use Macs online catalog to look it up and get the part number. Then google it and see what you can find.

I'd do it now, but I got to turn in.

Mart.

[Old Col]

Hi Henry, Ford made a shackle bush press to do this unpleasant job. It looks like this,





....it uses a variety of different size mandrels to press the bushings in and out, mandrels are recessed in the end to seat the curved ends of the original bushings so as to not crush the ends as they are pressed in place. The mandrel is the piece between the end of the thread and the new shackle in the picture. Usually the bushes won't press out after lengthy service as they're distorted like yours are,so Mart's hacksaw method of removal works well. Make sure you do what others have already advised,clean up the bores and polish the shackle outer case,then layer on plenty of lube......don't be tempted to try to smack them in with a big hammer, all that'll happen is they'll go part way in and the ends will deform and bell out and not go in,or come out again. I've found modern repro's to be fairly soft in the casing, so if you can track down original NOS items somehow,it'll be worth the effort. Repro's tend to have rubber inserts in them where Ford used a woven fabric impregnated with lube. It outlasts the thin low grade rubber signifigantly ( as already mentioned), ....

[Old Henry]

Looks like the bushing comes with the bolt/pin/stud in a kit with the shackles and lower bolt/stud/pin and bushings. Couldn't find NOS so ordered the complete kit from C&G. When it comes in I'll decide how to switch the parts out. I may try a little pounding to get the old bushings out but if not quickly successful will turn it over to the local old car garage with guys my age that have actually worked on these old cars to remove the old bushing and install the new stuff. I'll keep my old original shackles as no new ones are sculptured like they are but replace the rest of the parts.

[russcc]

The KR Wilson tool does it right, but you need start with NOS or NORS shackle bushings. Ray Helgers in RI has them, also try Fred at South Side Obsolete or Ron at Dennis Carpenter NOS. If you search for Kube's post you will find the correct way to do it.

[richard crow]

if you decide to replace with factory type try to get n.o.s. most of the after market ones are to large & imposible to press in with out damage. when you get the replacement bushing mike the outer dia. if to large turn the bushing shell to the correct size. if there the correct size you don,t need a vice or king kong.

[Kube]

Guys, the repop bushings I have encountered are pretty decent. Some guys state they are "too big" in diameter. They are SUPPOSED to be .004" - 005" oversize. They are SUPPOSED to be pressed in.
Guys that grind them down to install defeat the purpose of replacing them. That rather large "press fit" is designed so that the pin / bushing "torques" when the spring is deflected - thereby forcing the spring back to the correct position.
Henry, DO NOT attempt to hammer on the new pin. It won't work - period.
I mentioned in another post (good shocks) by Henry that his front spring is beyond "shot". Now that we see the pins,coupled with that spring, I have to believe that car rides and handles like poopy.
Henry, without the proper press, this job is best left to a guy with the proper tools.

[Gary in La.]

Here is the complete KR Wilson tool set for this job. It may give you some ideas as to what you can make and how heavy duty the tools need to be.

[Old Col]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

.... I may try a little pounding but if not quickly successful will turn it over to the local old car garage with guys my age that have actually worked on these old cars to remove the old bushing and install the new stuff

....Hi again Henry, better order 2 sets of bushes then if the hammer method is your plan.....

PS, I am one of those guys who've spent all their working lives on early Fords.....good luck,Col,.

[Tinker]

Henry I hope the bones are hollowed out too much. It is fixable if it is.

Hey if the spring is something you want to update from your prior build I would suggest a eaton Detroit spring. Little spendy but a life time plus replacement. Spring for your money.

Keep on keeping on!

[fordor41]

I replaced mine on my '41 with moly impregnated nylon. Have been in for 19+ yrs and no sign of wear. If you have access to a lathe you can buy the material in rod form from McMaster-Carr and fab them any size you need.

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Old Col

....Hi again Henry, better order 2 sets of bushes then if the hammer method is your plan.....

Any mention I made of hammering was only to remove the old bushings, not to install new ones. I will most likely let a competent garage do the whole thing once I get the parts in from C&G.

[Old Henry]

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Originally Posted by Tinker

Hey if the spring is something you want to update from your prior build I would suggest a eaton Detroit spring. Little spendy but a life time plus replacement. Spring for your money.
Keep on keeping on!

Can't think of any reason I'd replace that spring that's working just fine. If I did it would be with a stock spring but I don't see that happening in the foreseeable future. The spring and whole front end works just fine. On the 845 mile road trip we took last weekend it went down the road straight and smooth without any fighting of the steering wheel. Used to be if I loaded the back end way down it would want to wander a bit on the front end but I've put air adjustable shocks on the back to lift if up if that's ever a problem.

Thanks for the idea anyway.

[Kube]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Can't think of any reason I'd replace that spring that's working just fine. If I did it would be with a stock spring but I don't see that happening in the foreseeable future. The spring and whole front end works just fine. On the 845 mile road trip we took last weekend it went down the road straight and smooth without any fighting of the steering wheel. Used to be if I loaded the back end way down it would want to wander a bit on the front end but I've put air adjustable shocks on the back to lift if up if that's ever a problem.

Thanks for the idea anyway.

Henry, You would be amazed at the difference a good spring installed to your car would make. If you think it's "okay" now...

[bill h]

Get a spring shop to check your spring. Buy the picture it doesn't look to healthy. They can make you a spring if needed. It has to come apart anyway.

[waterboychuck]

I'm doing the same job on my 48 F1. I removed mine with a air hammer. It worked great.

[Henry Hopper]

Ive had success in the past when fitting bearings by freezing them first and warming the hub....the micro contraction and expansion of the two components made them a drop in fit.I would think a similar result may be obtained on fitting new shackle pin bushes.

I used liquid refrigerant to freeze the parts, as I have plenty in the service van with my job, but I guess leaving them in the freezer overnight would suffice.....worth a try I guess.

[Kube]

Originally Posted by Henry Hopper

Ive had success in the past when fitting bearings by freezing them first and warming the hub....the micro contraction and expansion of the two components made them a drop in fit.I would think a similar result may be obtained on fitting new shackle pin bushes.

I used liquid refrigerant to freeze the parts, as I have plenty in the service van with my job, but I guess leaving them in the freezer overnight would suffice.....worth a try I guess.

This method would help but I don't think it would be the best method for this particular application. #1) it's spring steel- a guy does not want to get it red hot and 2) there is approximately a .005" press fit. The heat / freeze combination would not be enough for a 3/4" diameter sleeve.

[B-O-B]

Anti seize works for me on the 34 front shackle replacement.

[larrys40]

Originally Posted by Kube

Henry, You would be amazed at the difference a good spring installed to your car would make. If you think it's "okay" now...

Henry,
I agree with Kube. Most original front springs are shot. Fortunately NOS or good NORS ones are still around for 46-48's. As Kube said.. you are better off pressing in the studs. I prefer the originals as they are still around. They are hardened, some repros are soft. Admittedly this job is a piece of cake for me as I've done many and use a KR Wilson shackle/remover/install tool as prescribed/shown in another post. If you can find someone in your local group/area who has one that is my suggestion.

If you elect to try a new spring you will be glad you did.
Thanks,
Larry S

[Ralph Moore]

I heated my spring slightly and put the bushings outside to cool, temperature was about 30 below zero. Still a pain to put them in, even with an installation tool. Just not an easy way to do this.

[Mart]

The spring is the easy part.

You can get the end of the spring in the vice. Two suitable sockets and the bush will go in ok. The spring, (being a spring) will have some "give" which makes it easier.

I wouldn't do it on the car, though.

It's those pesky perches that cause me all the trouble.

Mart.

[Kerk]

I made 2 pieces to press/drive the old ones out and also press or drive the new ones in.. Threeaded the end so it would bottom out on the end of the new pin shaped to match the pin and bushing. Used an Arbor press on the spring and a hammer on the vehicle part. Same type for removal with the O.D. Under the 3/4 Dia. worked for me.

[Old Henry]

Got my parts in. I'll now turn it over to the pros with the right tools and equipment and experience and knowhow to make the change.

Thanks for all of your ideas. At this point, as in many of this kind of project, if I can pay someone else to do it right I'll do it. I can tell that some of you still get quite a kick out of these major repair challenges. My real joy is in just driving the wheels off and seeing where and how far I can coax Old Henry to go.

[Veeder]

I am so in the middle of this I wish I had Video taped the whole adventure!! Going on my 4th shackle as a result of damaging them :-) FUN FUN FUN

[Kube]

Originally Posted by Veeder

I am so in the middle of this I wish I had Video taped the whole adventure!! Going on my 4th shackle as a result of damaging them :-) FUN FUN FUN

It's actually quite an easy job with the proper tools. See post #21. That's the same set I have. Takes about 15 minutes to R&R a pin.

[TJ]

Henry, that spring is shot. Take a look at the main leaf as it starts to wrap around the shackle bushing. From all appearances it appears to be fractured. It looks like the only thing holding it in place is the second safety leaf. Let us know what the shop says about the spring. It wouldn't surprise me that the piece falls off after the bushing is removed.

[bill h]

I did my rear ones. Took them to a spring shop after wrecking a few. Not rocket science but like any job the right tools make any job easy. Had my rear end apart. (another story but i made seal drivers to install seals. Tools made the job easy) The shop charged me twenty bucks to install the bushings while i waited took about a minute. Good luck

[jerseyboy]

As I needed to replace the shackle bushings on my wagon, I read this thread with interest.

I took Mart's approach and hammered out the bolts. I then started to cut the jacket with a hacksaw. This seemed like a tediuos process, so I tried to think of a better way to remove the jackets.

I decided I was going to use the all-thread I had used to remove the springs.

I placed a deep 11mm socket at one end and a section of pipe, the same diameter as the spring perch, at the other end.

I then ran the all-thread thru these with a washer and nut at each end.

I simply turned the nut and pushed/pulled the jacket out.

I know one side was in pretty good, but the other side and worn thru the jacket, so that came out pretty easy.

One, note, I did work the bolt back and forth with a pipe wrench and pipe before I hammered it out.



Thanks for all the ideas.

Keep V-8ing and 4-banging!

[1oldtimer]

So what was the outcome??? good as new .

[36coupe]

Originally Posted by fordor41

I replaced mine on my '41 with moly impregnated nylon. Have been in for 19+ yrs and no sign of wear. If you have access to a lathe you can buy the material in rod form from McMaster-Carr and fab them any size you need.

I was thinking there has to be a modern type material that is superior to the original.
Would Oilite work or it it too soft?
I bought some speedway shackles and they have a plastic bushing?
C&G has the proper bushings, I think.

[jerseyboy]

I'm using Pete and Jakes shackles and bushings.

Keep V-8ing and 4-banging!

[Ralph Moore]

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One thing I have not seen mentioned ( unless I missed it) is the need to clock the new bushing in place. Because of the square stud and torque design it should be put in at the right position to line up with the shackes and opposing bushing stud. Correct?

[1oldtimer]

Originally Posted by 36coupe

I was thinking there has to be a modern type material that is superior to the original.
Would Oilite work or it it too soft?
I bought some speedway shackles and they have a plastic bushing?
C&G has the proper bushings, I think.

I believe some of the hot rod places are selling Oillite bushing. I bought some for my '28, but it hasn't seen the road yet.

[Brendan]

I can tell you that hammering is no good, when I put them in my pickup I bought 4 0f them, 2 to f#%k up and 2 that worked

[flatford8]

I tried hammering spring bushings in on the rear of a Chebby one-ton. Its like trying to dent your tire by hitting it with a hammer. You get nowhere .....MARK

[SofaKing]

I followed this thread because I am replacing the rears now and it went very well. I rented a balljoint press from oreilly auto parts (free there) and with a socket and piece of flat steel pressed the new ones in both the spring and perches. I removed the old sleeves with a saw, punches, chisels and a cheap muffler type air hammer, not fun. Take a look and you will see the similarity between the ball joint press and the correct factory tool. Like others I put a little anti seize in the bores. I also used a ball shaped stone to remove rust from the bores but was careful not to wallow out the holes. A little improvisation was required.