Totally Rouge '51 Custom??

[tubman]

Originally Posted by jaxV8carz

I've seen one other Fordomatic with the red indicator light on the left end of the dash. Was told it was a reminder for the emergency brake, coulda been an aftermarket add-on. Beautiful car.

My '51 (stick) car has a red light ,too, except mine is under the dash, attached to the lower flange. Mine is obviously an emergency brake warning light, as it is connected by a light multi-strand cable to the emergency brake handle. I would have to believe that mine is not from the factory.

That's a great looking car. My first '51 in high school was a 4 door.

[Walt Dupont--Me.]

Boy, that car can get lost in a snow bank. Beauty Walt

[corvette8n]

Sorry to hear about your friends health, tell him to hang in there, he has a very nice car.

[TJ]

If he decides to sell, it should not be advertised as a Rouge car. To be a Rouge car it has to have documentation from the Early Ford V-8 Club. If he believes it to be original he can certainly say that and then it's up to him to prove it. It looks like a nice car and just from the photos the chrome looks too good to be 51 chrome which wasn't worth a hoot even from the factory. The front carpet looks like it came out of somebody's bedroom and would be a killer if the car was judged on the interior. As a general rule if this was a police car it would have been a low trim model. I doubt that a police car(even a detective car in those days) would have the extra stainless trim on the front fenders, the stainless trim around the gas door and the backup lights. I think there should be some documentation to indicate that it did indeed belong to police chief.
This is a very nice old sedan, but if someone is selling a car they should have proof of the statements made about prior ownership. A smart buyer will ask for the documentation. JMHO

[Mike51Merc]

Originally Posted by TJ

If he decides to sell, it should not be advertised as a Rouge car. To be a Rouge car it has to have documentation from the Early Ford V-8 Club. If he believes it to be original he can certainly say that and then it's up to him to prove it. It looks like a nice car and just from the photos the chrome looks too good to be 51 chrome which wasn't worth a hoot even from the factory. The front carpet looks like it came out of somebody's bedroom and would be a killer if the car was judged on the interior. As a general rule if this was a police car it would have been a low trim model. I doubt that a police car(even a detective car in those days) would have the extra stainless trim on the front fenders, the stainless trim around the gas door and the backup lights. I think there should be some documentation to indicate that it did indeed belong to police chief.
This is a very nice old sedan, but if someone is selling a car they should have proof of the statements made about prior ownership. A smart buyer will ask for the documentation. JMHO

Have you never seen "Smokey and the Bandit" ?----- but seriously not all "police" cars are fleet cars or strippers--- it just depends on the departmental budget. They can buy off the showroom floor too. In this case I don't think the police history impacts value anyway.

SO by the way can anybody explain what this Rouge stuff is all about?

[Old Henry]

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Originally Posted by Mike51Merc

SO by the way can anybody explain what this Rouge stuff is all about?

Here's my understanding: It is an award given by the Early Ford V8 Club of America to cars that are still original that have not been restored. It is named after the River Rouge on which the Ford plant was located in Dearborn Michigan. Three categories of original condition are recognized: drive train, body, and upholstery. So, a car may receive Rouge recognition if the drive train is still all original even if the body and upholstery have been restored, etc. The highest Rouge recognition is when all three categories are original and unrestored. That is the Dearborn award.

If I missed anything someone chime in to correct.

[Mike51Merc]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Here's my understanding: It is an award given by the Early Ford V8 Club of America to cars that are still original that have not been restored. It is named after the River Rouge on which the Ford plant was located in Dearborn Michigan. Three categories of original condition are recognized: drive train, body, and upholstery. So, a car may receive Rouge recognition if the drive train is still all original even if the body and upholstery have been restored, etc. The highest Rouge recognition is when all three categories are original and unrestored. That is the Dearborn award.

If I missed anything someone chime in to correct.

It must be fairly obscure because Google gave me nothing related to it. So it recognizes what some people call "Survivors" (an unrestored running original in very good condition), although some people call any car that hasn't been crushed a Survivor, especially in the classified ads.

[VeryTangled]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

The highest Rouge recognition is when all three categories are original and unrestored. That is the Dearborn award.

If I missed anything someone chime in to correct.

Greetings Everyone; Professor, Mostly correct. Here's my two cents. The Dearborn Award is for point judged cars (which have earned 950 out of 1000, possibly on two occasions), usually the premier restored cars. Dearborn cars are in equal condition to showroom or as the club says "As Henry Built It."

Rouge are un-restored within reason (I believe the threshold is 90% original, in at least one of the three categories).

To add a little... It would be a very unusual car that could compete in both classes (in two different meets). For example the slight tear on the driver's front seat is not a deduction for Rouge because the seat cover is (assumed from here to be...) original no matter the condition, but a definite deduction for Concourse/Dearborn because that wouldn't fly in the showroom.

I personally don't have a car that qualifies for either class, so I'm not totally in tune with the rules for some of the V8 Club awards.

[TJ]

Originally Posted by Mike51Merc

Have you never seen "Smokey and the Bandit" ?----- but seriously not all "police" cars are fleet cars or strippers--- it just depends on the departmental budget. They can buy off the showroom floor too. In this case I don't think the police history impacts value anyway.

SO by the way can anybody explain what this Rouge stuff is all about?

I think if you read my post I said "as a general rule" police cars were the low trim models. In days gone by some places paid the chief to use his own car for official business. The police history can impact the value. Not specifically because it was a police car, but it does trace previous owners. Being able to contact previous owners can tell a person if the owner made any changes to the car, etc. Tracing previous owners and documenting the cars history can have a definite impact on the value of a nice original car. Some people may not care about history, but many do care.
I don't know if you are an Early ford V-8 club member or not, but if you are there is a complete listing on the judging categories in the front of the club roster. Jeff has given a good definition between Dearborn and Rouge class. Since these are categories specific to the V-8 club "Google' may not have that information. You can find the information at; www.earlyfordv8.org.

[Old Henry]

This car was not used as a "police car". It was used by the police chief then was given it to him for personal use when he retired.

[flatford8]

Great car !!!!....IMHO what shoebox isn't??? It ain't just about '32-'40....The seat belts wouldn't be factory would they??....As far as selling it, sorry to hear he has health issues... maybe somebody in his family wants it or he could get someone from EFV8 to help him. At least help him price it....$15k ish???...I'm basing that on a comparison to mine. Mine is certainly not a Rouge car...But when I'm going down the road, looking out the winshield, it feels like it's worth a million bucks.... Mark

[Old Henry]

He's had it for sale for a month at $15,000 on a statewide classified here in Utah and has had one call. I suggested he list it nationally on Hemmings, Classic Cars, or eBay.

[flatford8]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

He's had it for sale for a month at $15,000 on a statewide classified here in Utah and has had one call. I suggested he list it nationally on Hemmings, Classic Cars, or eBay.

Good advice I'd say....Mark

[rotorwrench]

The more folks see it, the better chance that it will attract a buyer for sure. 4-door cars aren't as attractive as the 2-door models but some folks are looking for nostalgia and may have had some of their best times in a 4-door like that.

I'd love to have a 51 Merc coupe but I have a lot of fond memories for my Dads old 4-door 51 Sport Sedan so I'd say there could be a buyer out there that would like to have an old memory back or even just to have an historic original. Not too many cars out there that are that old and still in that nice a condition these days.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

He's had it for sale for a month at $15,000 on a statewide classified here in Utah and has had one call. I suggested he list it nationally on Hemmings, Classic Cars, or eBay.

For your perusal this price guide from NADA.


http://www.nadaguides.com/Classic-Cars/1951/Ford/Custom/4-Door-Sedan/Values

[40cpe]

That's a really nice car. A two-door with overdrive in that condition could be worth $15000.

[Mike51Merc]

You can also go to www.hagerty.com and use their price guide.

[Ianrhall]

What is a rouge award? Don't have that in the uk
Ian

[TJ]

Originally Posted by VeryTangled

Greetings Everyone; Professor, Mostly correct. Here's my two cents. The Dearborn Award is for point judged cars (which have earned 950 out of 1000, possibly on two occasions), usually the premier restored cars. Dearborn cars are in equal condition to showroom or as the club says "As Henry Built It."

Rouge are un-restored within reason (I believe the threshold is 90% original, in at least one of the three categories).

To add a little... It would be a very unusual car that could compete in both classes (in two different meets). For example the slight tear on the driver's front seat is not a deduction for Rouge because the seat cover is (assumed from here to be...) original no matter the condition, but a definite deduction for Concourse/Dearborn because that wouldn't fly in the showroom.

I personally don't have a car that qualifies for either class, so I'm not totally in tune with the rules for some of the V8 Club awards.

Ian, here's a good summary of the Rouge award that is given by the Early Ford V-8 Club.

[Ianrhall]

I was told my 53 won a/some rouge awards, wasn't sure what it meant!
Thanks
Ian