The Ford Barn

Bubsyouruncle · 01-30-2014, 11:50 AM

I tried a search of the forums on this subject and found two or three threads that provided some information but I have questions.

The first replacement wiring harness I got for my '32 I purchased from a Ford dealer in 1956 or '57. I am going to assume that it was NOS. The car had a sealed beam replacement hoo-rah with a spliced connector that ran from headlights to the harness. The harness has now failed, the cotton falling apart in various places, and I have replaced it with a current offering from MACS. The replacement is pretty close to the original replacement in size, color, feel, coding, and, most importantly, lengths of wires and end of wire terminals. Ford part # 18-11646 or 647, depending on cowl lamps or not.

I am reverting to the reflector/bulb/lens originally installed. And, yes, the repro sockets are crap. The repro reflectors are OK, with a little tweaking. I have NOS lenses. The difficulty I face is this: Nowhere could I find the wires that go from the wiring harness to the bottom of the headlights. This is Ford part number B-14578-A which included the outer stainless flexible conduit as well as the three wires inside. Now that number is used by all vendors for the conduit only and they sell you a pair of them.

I do realize that this was a pretty hokey way to connect the headlights to the main wiring harness. And I am certain that most owners, the first time they had problems with the headlights browning and shorting out, stripped out the funny stuff and soldered in a solid connection.

But I would like to try to replicate what Henry did originally.

Help??

1931 flamingo · 01-30-2014, 11:56 AM

Have you tried Sac Vintage Ford in CA?? They make harnesses like original.
Paul in CT

DICK SPADARO · 01-30-2014, 01:57 PM

You cant find the wires because there are none. The headlight harness from the steering column base to the headlights is the wire. The wire circuit is split L - R and rear, the wires rout to the headlight thru the grille shell and conduits. 3 wires each usually, The wires go thru the condit and then junction at a 3 pin cylindrical block that inserts into the socket of the headlite assembly. The head light pig tail then indexes the wires to color code and clips into the bucket junction completing the circuit.

Bubsyouruncle · 01-30-2014, 05:46 PM

Dick, thanks for the response but I fear that I must say you are wrong for 1932. From 1933 on you may be correct, I guess.

The 11646/647 is a good two feet too short to reach the headlight buckets.

The first attachment is from an old catalogue from Tom Meyer V-8 Ford in Oregon, Wisconsin. I am going to guess that the diagram is from some Ford manual. You will notice that it shows the 14578 in the wiring diagram.

The second attachment is a picture of the end of the wires in the 11647 harness, ending well short of the headlight.

rotorwrench · 01-30-2014, 07:25 PM

The replacement parts are definitely not as good as the bakelite or micarta block with the pins to complete the cannon plug style twist connectors that were OEM. I can't help on what the suppliers are selling for headlamp bucket wiring but they may be making the bucket wiring longer to meet the bullet connector terminals down in the radiator shell. This stuff pretty much has to be fabricated by the home tinkerer now days. You might contact Rhode Island Wire and see what they supply. If nothing else, a guy could get the correct type color coded wires and some terminal connectors and fab up a set. A person could fabricate the twist connector parts for the conduit connetion to the lamps but you would have to source the raw materials and whittle the stuff out. Restoration Supply Co has some raw materials in there catalog and Rhode Island Wire may have some too.

DICK SPADARO · 01-30-2014, 08:20 PM

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Thanks for the picture it's small I think you have the wrong harness. its not 32 Ford, I think its 33/34 PU, they use long pigtails on the light sockets. Your harness should be long and carry right up to the Headlight like a Model A. The 3 wire color code is Black with yellow tracer for parking, if no cowl light, one Black with red trace for Low beam and one black with red trace for High beam. Any other color combination is not 32 Ford. You should only have these colors. A green or Blue code wire is something else so I dont think that the harness you thought you purchased was marked correctly. Usually a blue code wire is Horn. The IDr is where the horn wire is, this connection should be a short two contact pigtail off the left frame rail running up to the lower area of the grille separate from the light power wires. If you have extra color wires running in the sleeve with the head light wires its somewhere a 33/6 passenger car as those are the horn power wires. If your only issue is a color match and have a short connection you have 33/34 Pickup harness.

DavidG · 01-30-2014, 11:20 PM

Sorry Bubsyouruncle, but Dick is correct. The Tom Meyer illustration is incorrectly labelled as it is obviously for a '33-'34 pickup (note the steering column lock and the shape of the head lamps) and the harness in the photo is not the equivalent of the original. In other words, originally the head lamp wires incorporated into the wiring harness ran all the way to the ends of the conduit. There was no transition section of wiring between the wiring harness and the end of the conduits.

In the photo below, the harness's lamp wiring terminates at the end of the conduit as shown. From that point to the bulbs, there's a short transition to the bulb socket shown in the black and white photo (one bulb and two bulb versions, i.e. without cowl lamps). The second to last illustration is Ford's engineering drawing of a cutaway version of a head lamp showing the various components and how they are connected.

As for the colors of the original wiring (and that of a good reproduction), those are shown in the original wiring diagram in the last illustration.

Bubsyouruncle · 01-31-2014, 12:58 PM

OK Guys. Thanks for the good feedback

F.O.R.D. Figure On Regular Discrepancies

Rotorwrench - That is kinda where I think I am. The real trick is the terminals. If you look at the Ford picture that DavidG provided, you will notice that the ends of the wires in the 14646/7 harness terminate in flat-topped terminals, not the interconnecting bullet terminals. Those terminals are going to be hard to find (I have already tried).

DavidG - great pictures, but I wish the Ford drawing were clearer. I can't read any of the numbers. Mine is a late '32, so I have a fuse block. That doesn't make any difference to the headlight wiring "problem", however.

Dick S. - OK, so my Ford dealer sold me the wrong harness in 1957 and the replacement from MACS matches it almost exactly 50 years later. I am not arguing with your analysis. This harness is exactly correct in wire color and number and where they go and how they are bundled together. And if you are using sealed beams you wouldn't be using the original connections anyway. The only discrepancy seems to be in the length of the headlight (and horn) wires.

So I am presented with the following dilemma: Should I order another wiring harness from one of the vendors (they all are probably selling the same harness) and hope that I get one with the longer headlight and horn wires with the correct terminals OR should I attempt to make my own transition cables to go from the harness I have to the headlights and horn?

B-O-B · 01-31-2014, 01:36 PM

The wires are either in the headlight bucket or conduit & hidden so who is know but you. If it were mine I would just cut & splice to desired length. But then I'm not into concourse stuff. Can you remove the ends off the short wires & reattach them to some longer ones. I have done that by pulling the wire strands out one or two at a time then enlarging the hole in the connector & reattaching the wire to the terminal. But then everybody isn't as frugal as I am.

DavidG · 01-31-2014, 05:15 PM

Not all wiring harnesses on the market are created equal nor are they from the same source. If you order a harness from Tyree Harris of Bumpas, VA (that's not a joke), the wires will reach the end of the conduits and they will have the correct terminals on their ends.

rotorwrench · 01-31-2014, 07:22 PM

That old harness from the local Ford dealer may have been all that was available at the time. I've had fair luck with the connectors on my old model A but you have to make sure the plastic connector piece with the slotted holes is the correct length. I finally made my own parts from a big block of cloth laminated bakelite that was used for making cable fairleads in an old airplane. The key is getting the flat top terminals the correct depth into the slotted cylinder shaped connector insulator piece and having the whole connector piece the correct length to properly fit into the receptical in the bottom of the headlamp shell. That way the plug will have the proper tension against the spring terminals in the headlamp shell and they wont bottom out or try to bend over in there. The repro plastic parts are kind of light weight and don't hold up as well as the laminated bakelite does. They have to be drilled deeper to fit the flat top terminals well.

01-30-2014, 11:50 AM	#1
Bubsyouruncle Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Gurnee, Illinois Posts: 270	1932 headlight wires I tried a search of the forums on this subject and found two or three threads that provided some information but I have questions. The first replacement wiring harness I got for my '32 I purchased from a Ford dealer in 1956 or '57. I am going to assume that it was NOS. The car had a sealed beam replacement hoo-rah with a spliced connector that ran from headlights to the harness. The harness has now failed, the cotton falling apart in various places, and I have replaced it with a current offering from MACS. The replacement is pretty close to the original replacement in size, color, feel, coding, and, most importantly, lengths of wires and end of wire terminals. Ford part # 18-11646 or 647, depending on cowl lamps or not. I am reverting to the reflector/bulb/lens originally installed. And, yes, the repro sockets are crap. The repro reflectors are OK, with a little tweaking. I have NOS lenses. The difficulty I face is this: Nowhere could I find the wires that go from the wiring harness to the bottom of the headlights. This is Ford part number B-14578-A which included the outer stainless flexible conduit as well as the three wires inside. Now that number is used by all vendors for the conduit only and they sell you a pair of them. I do realize that this was a pretty hokey way to connect the headlights to the main wiring harness. And I am certain that most owners, the first time they had problems with the headlights browning and shorting out, stripped out the funny stuff and soldered in a solid connection. But I would like to try to replicate what Henry did originally. Help??

01-30-2014, 11:56 AM	#2
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,393	Re: 1932 headlight wires Have you tried Sac Vintage Ford in CA?? They make harnesses like original. Paul in CT

01-30-2014, 01:57 PM	#3
DICK SPADARO Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Altamont, NY Posts: 1,004	Re: 1932 headlight wires You cant find the wires because there are none. The headlight harness from the steering column base to the headlights is the wire. The wire circuit is split L - R and rear, the wires rout to the headlight thru the grille shell and conduits. 3 wires each usually, The wires go thru the condit and then junction at a 3 pin cylindrical block that inserts into the socket of the headlite assembly. The head light pig tail then indexes the wires to color code and clips into the bucket junction completing the circuit. __________________ dickspadaro.com

01-30-2014, 07:25 PM	#5
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,484	Re: 1932 headlight wires The replacement parts are definitely not as good as the bakelite or micarta block with the pins to complete the cannon plug style twist connectors that were OEM. I can't help on what the suppliers are selling for headlamp bucket wiring but they may be making the bucket wiring longer to meet the bullet connector terminals down in the radiator shell. This stuff pretty much has to be fabricated by the home tinkerer now days. You might contact Rhode Island Wire and see what they supply. If nothing else, a guy could get the correct type color coded wires and some terminal connectors and fab up a set. A person could fabricate the twist connector parts for the conduit connetion to the lamps but you would have to source the raw materials and whittle the stuff out. Restoration Supply Co has some raw materials in there catalog and Rhode Island Wire may have some too.

01-30-2014, 08:20 PM	#6
DICK SPADARO Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Altamont, NY Posts: 1,004	Re: 1932 headlight wires Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Thanks for the picture it's small I think you have the wrong harness. its not 32 Ford, I think its 33/34 PU, they use long pigtails on the light sockets. Your harness should be long and carry right up to the Headlight like a Model A. The 3 wire color code is Black with yellow tracer for parking, if no cowl light, one Black with red trace for Low beam and one black with red trace for High beam. Any other color combination is not 32 Ford. You should only have these colors. A green or Blue code wire is something else so I dont think that the harness you thought you purchased was marked correctly. Usually a blue code wire is Horn. The IDr is where the horn wire is, this connection should be a short two contact pigtail off the left frame rail running up to the lower area of the grille separate from the light power wires. If you have extra color wires running in the sleeve with the head light wires its somewhere a 33/6 passenger car as those are the horn power wires. If your only issue is a color match and have a short connection you have 33/34 Pickup harness. __________________ dickspadaro.com

01-31-2014, 12:58 PM	#8
Bubsyouruncle Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Gurnee, Illinois Posts: 270	Re: 1932 headlight wires OK Guys. Thanks for the good feedback F.O.R.D. Figure On Regular Discrepancies Rotorwrench - That is kinda where I think I am. The real trick is the terminals. If you look at the Ford picture that DavidG provided, you will notice that the ends of the wires in the 14646/7 harness terminate in flat-topped terminals, not the interconnecting bullet terminals. Those terminals are going to be hard to find (I have already tried). DavidG - great pictures, but I wish the Ford drawing were clearer. I can't read any of the numbers. Mine is a late '32, so I have a fuse block. That doesn't make any difference to the headlight wiring "problem", however. Dick S. - OK, so my Ford dealer sold me the wrong harness in 1957 and the replacement from MACS matches it almost exactly 50 years later. I am not arguing with your analysis. This harness is exactly correct in wire color and number and where they go and how they are bundled together. And if you are using sealed beams you wouldn't be using the original connections anyway. The only discrepancy seems to be in the length of the headlight (and horn) wires. So I am presented with the following dilemma: Should I order another wiring harness from one of the vendors (they all are probably selling the same harness) and hope that I get one with the longer headlight and horn wires with the correct terminals OR should I attempt to make my own transition cables to go from the harness I have to the headlights and horn?

01-31-2014, 01:36 PM	#9
B-O-B Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ft Mohave,Az Posts: 1,988	Re: 1932 headlight wires The wires are either in the headlight bucket or conduit & hidden so who is know but you. If it were mine I would just cut & splice to desired length. But then I'm not into concourse stuff. Can you remove the ends off the short wires & reattach them to some longer ones. I have done that by pulling the wire strands out one or two at a time then enlarging the hole in the connector & reattaching the wire to the terminal. But then everybody isn't as frugal as I am.

01-31-2014, 05:15 PM	#10
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,126	Re: 1932 headlight wires Not all wiring harnesses on the market are created equal nor are they from the same source. If you order a harness from Tyree Harris of Bumpas, VA (that's not a joke), the wires will reach the end of the conduits and they will have the correct terminals on their ends.

01-31-2014, 07:22 PM	#11
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,484	Re: 1932 headlight wires That old harness from the local Ford dealer may have been all that was available at the time. I've had fair luck with the connectors on my old model A but you have to make sure the plastic connector piece with the slotted holes is the correct length. I finally made my own parts from a big block of cloth laminated bakelite that was used for making cable fairleads in an old airplane. The key is getting the flat top terminals the correct depth into the slotted cylinder shaped connector insulator piece and having the whole connector piece the correct length to properly fit into the receptical in the bottom of the headlamp shell. That way the plug will have the proper tension against the spring terminals in the headlamp shell and they wont bottom out or try to bend over in there. The repro plastic parts are kind of light weight and don't hold up as well as the laminated bakelite does. They have to be drilled deeper to fit the flat top terminals well.